how are you how you doing uh I’m doing well how are you yeah very well thank you very well it’s
been um quiet season because it’s cold over here how’s it how’s it over there is it yeah yeah I’m in I’m in New York
uh to see some New York city so yeah we’re down to what I would call unsatisfactory playing
conditions so the The Season’s going to hibernate for a bit here and you’re not a professional are you
you’re just a a successful amateur yeah so the the angle you know my unique
situation and the coaching profession is that I I’m not a swing professional
um I am a golfer and I’ve chosen to coach golfers from a player’s
perspective and I think that’s The Voice I’ve tried to develop over the last eight years and I think that’s why
some people resonate with my book and what I’ve been writing about on my website for years is that I come at it
from from the player from the perspective of a golfer so that’s kind of my unique spin on things so I’m not
I’m not a swing professional I know some things about the golf swing but I don’t teach it Bruce is a resident swing enthusiastic
so I think he’s the one that kind of does all these things for us but I should introduce you yeah um John the owner of practical golf
which I suppose we’ll try and get on to in a bit the co-host of The Sweet Spot podcast and I’m now Amazon best-selling
author so you are the second co-host of The Sweet Spot podcast we’ve had you
know Adam and I usually end up on the same podcast together eventually yeah you’re
about 90 podcasts late though he was okay that’s all right he was episode 70 and this is 100 40 161 so oh yeah the UK
connection here the UK connection so I uh hey I’m not I’m not offended at all
so tell us um John a little bit about where it all started tell us a little bit about practical golf
um so somewhere in you know the probably like 2014 I uh as I was getting back
into golf and getting better at it I I was just taking a look at what game
improvement information was available to Golfers um online and I wasn’t really satisfied
uh I I felt that yeah the golf swing was everywhere and
that’s all people talked about that was really no different than how it was when I was a junior golfer and I just felt
that there were topics that I was passionate about I had some expertise in that that weren’t being
covered so I just bought a web domain and started typing articles about those
topics they weren’t very good at first but I got you know a few people reading them and I refined my ideas along the
way and ultimately it led to me to the the other four main topics that I focus on which are ultimately became the the
book the four foundations of golf so I kind of started at it as a bit of an outsider trying to remind people of I
think things that a lot of golfers figured out over the years but if I felt
I could communicate it in a way that was very simple and people could identify with then I could get them to change
their habits and get better at golf so that that’s that was kind of the Genesis of the idea
so yeah tell us a little bit more about what you mentioned at the start there John so you said you kind of taken a few
years away from the game um am I thinking now you’re a very accomplished goal for plus two handicap or so have
you always been pretty pretty handy and and then you took some time off and and kind of fell out of love with the game
is that the backstory yeah yeah I think I I was a you know I I was a kid who was
obsessed with every sport so I played a lot of different sports and when I came to golf at 12 or 13 I was like wow this
is something that I I just you know really got bit by the bug and that was
the exact moment when tiger went pro uh right so it was a perfect time to get
into golf um and yeah I just I just I got very obsessed with the game I got pretty good
I I have a much better golfer now than I was in in high school I was I was the
captain of a very mediocre golf team I think I had my best at those days was probably like a three four five handicap
something like that I played a little bit in college and when I say a little bit it I mean one tournament and then I
just kind of I didn’t necessarily quit I just kind of stopped playing for a while I was living in New York City and then I
had this unfortunate spell of probably seven to ten years where I when
I did get to play golf I didn’t really enjoy it much I expected too much of myself um wasn’t a very happy golfer and you
know ultimately like when I moved out of New York City I became a father and could get into the game again that’s
where I kind of figure it out or undid all that damage I had done to myself and as I got to
scratch level I’m like okay I think I figured a few things out maybe I can help some other golfers because I know
exactly what they’re dealing with because I dealt with it all those years and still deal with it so yeah I I was a
I wasn’t okay I was an okay Junior golfer but nothing exceptional
and why is it that you think that changed for you or is it that that was the real light bulb moment where you
thought okay that this is it uh there’s probably several along the way
but I I think one of the one of the things that I had to balance
and I call it kind of my my formula for golf Happiness is when I could align my
expectation level with the amount of time and effort I was willing to put into the game and make sure those were
at a nice balance that’s when things started clicking for me that’s when I
really started playing better stopped losing my temper as much um felt more
I just had more enjoyment as well and I I kind of finally came to terms with what I wanted
out of golf and what I was willing to put into it I think that formula is different for everyone because not everyone has unlimited time to practice
some people can only play five times a year so you know I I found that version
of goth happiness for myself and continue to work at it and I wanted to share some of that with other people so
that that’s really one of the main things I want to do you know with my site my book our podcast anything is I really want people
to have a healthy relationship with golf and of course I want them to get better too but you can’t do the second thing
without the first thing yeah I find I find that like expectations is a difficult thing isn’t
it because it is my expectation levels Change Daily you know like I I I I you
know I I listen to that to that story of yours and I think yeah you know I I go through periods where I feel like
you know my you know my expectation levels are dropped because I I’m putting in less effort and then all of a sudden that frees you up and
you have one good round and all of a sudden I feel like I should be a scratch golfer you know and then I put stress back on myself so how do you you know
how do you think that people can maintain a an acceptable expectation
level there’s a lot of ways to go about it you know through statistics showing people what are reasonable outcomes for
different skill levels um I think in your instance when you’re dealing with
that daily weekly or even monthly fluctuation of golf like the game is very very volatile
and even for the pros you know you you look at a PGA Tour player’s full year
and you look at the range of scores that they have you know you’re going to see for certain players you get scores as
low as 62 and as scores as 80 80 182 like what do you think they’re thinking you know I’ve seen said there’s there’s
pro golfers who shoot 63 and then 80. and what do you think’s going through their head and they’re the best in the world so you know understanding that no
matter how good you get at this game there’s always going to be that volatility of the golfer that shows up
from day to day week to week or month to month and knowing that’s okay like I tweeted out recently that I asked people
to give me their lowest score their highest score and their handicap over the last year and we got like an insane
amount of responses and all of them were like 20 30 plus stroke yeah
um differences same with me um so I think just letting go and accepting
that you know that this game it will Jekyll and hide you and there’s going to
be months where you feel confident weeks you feel confident and then all of a sudden it can just go away
um and I think where golfers golfers struggle is that then all of a sudden they start trying to change everything
they’re trying to change their swing their approach to the game and I call that kind of like switching lanes
in a traffic jam and you’re kind of getting nowhere um and of course you want to be working on the right things but even if you are
that it’s going to happen so yeah that that’s one of the best ways I can explain the answer to that question is
just letting go and accepting that this game is
crazy yeah for lack of a better word but it’s interesting yeah the way you
put it there talking about enjoying the game more I mean you know I think you mentioned it in a
tweet a few days ago like one of the great aspects or I guess defining features of golf is
that it can offer you so much you know there’s the camaraderie there’s the travel going and seeing different courses
um the competitive element the history course architecture there’s so many almost discreet areas of this game and
yet everyone wants to play it better and it’s hard to really think of many other sports or just general kind of human
endeavors where people can have such dysfunctional relationships with something that they should really enjoy I mean we recorded a
podcast with Martin Ed’s a couple weeks back who mainly looking at it from the sort of Swing side of things but you
know he was just laughing at how there are so many golfers out there not just professionals at the absolute top of the
game but but golfers of every ability who have you know pushed a bit too hard maybe
their expectations have gotten a little high they’ve tried to chase after improvement with maybe a little bit
too much enthusiasm and and all of a sudden find themselves not being able to hit the ball not being able to put
together a score and fun 19 not enjoying it and I don’t know what it is about golf whether it’s just the sheer number
of variables there are involved in the game um and how many things you’re trying to manage and and you know kind
of hold together in this very fragile Arrangement that can make it so crazily varied in terms of the Peaks
and the troughs that you have yeah it’s I’ve always I’ve always been fascinated
when I play golf with people from all different walks of life I’ve
gotten to play with like ex-pro athletes like really accomplished business people
um and just really like outside of golf like really high performance type people and then
you see them on the golf course and everything they’re able to do in their professional career outside of golf just
like literally goes out the window yeah you know they’re losing their temper like everything that makes them great at what
what they what they’re you know known for disappears in golf and I’ve always found that fascinating to me because
yeah this game has a way of like humbling literally just about anyone even even the pro golfers like I think
one of the best examples recently was I figure it was a 2021 when tiger made a
12 on or 10 on number 12 in Augusta and it was just like a moment where everyone
was like oh my God the wheels like I’ve never I’ve been watching tiger obsessively since I was a kid I don’t
think I’ve ever seen the wheels come off like that um and then he made like five birdies in
a row of course but it it just like he looked he looked totally lost and just
it Goff did it to him too so um yeah it’s a crazy game but like you
said there’s so many different ways there’s all these like little sub niches
of golf now that are very cool and different ways to enjoy it and be enthusiastic about it but you have to temper that with this like well how good
do I want to get how hard do I want to push it and that’s something I always ask myself throughout the season like
are you having fun like I compete a lot and like this summer I pulled out of a few tournaments because I felt myself
getting burnt out and I’m like you know I don’t I’m not playing to be a
uh a pro golfer I’m not good enough this is for recreation even if it’s you know serious competition so if I’m not
enjoying it right now I’m just going to kind of take a step back so I have to continue asking myself that question too
is is this fun am I enjoying this well it’s an interesting one that you talk about because it’s kind of one of
the reasons that I I was Keen to get you on the podcast because I saw a tweet that you put out kind of seven ways to
practice I think what it was because I I find myself um I think I represent a large band of
golfers in the world the are not afraid to practice but
it’s it’s poor practice you know and I feel like I’ve come from a background
where I’ve played a little bit of rugby and you turn up and the coach says to you right today you’re doing this okay
that’s fine I’ll go off and do that and you do it and maybe makes you better but it kind of you get told it and you do it
then you come into the World of Golf and you just go to a driving range because that’s what everyone does and
you pick up a seven eye and you hit it because that’s what everyone does and then obviously after four swings you hit just hit driver for 56 balls and then
um but then it’s all over you go home and you don’t really learn much and you don’t maybe you get in a Groove because
you just smashing balls every 30 seconds but I feel like
I feel like I mean you and Adam have done a fantastic job of trying to get information out there but there’s not an
incredible amount of information on how to practice well which is I suppose something that kind
of holds a lot of golfers back yeah it’s it’s something I struggled with as a junior golfer I
would I would hit hundreds of balls and as you said get into a Groove where I
would like but I was a good ball Striker and I felt like oh my God I’m gonna go out there
and tear this place apart you know my next High School golf match it’ll just be a total disaster so you know that the
mistake I made and other golfers make is I was not I was not preparing myself for
golf I wasn’t really engaged I was just kind of rifling through every ball like what chance do you have to do that on
the golf course I wasn’t thinking I didn’t have a Target I just hit hit hit hit and yeah that’s the unfortunate part
about golf versus other sports is that yeah there’s more straightforward uh
paths to success I believe in other sports versus golf um and it’s hard to put my finger on
what exactly that is about golf probably because the golf swing is complicated but you know a lot of the stuff that
Adam has talked about in the practice manual and his awesome you know website we discussed together on our podcast is
you know for the golfers who aren’t necessarily taking lessons what can you do to be engaged properly and challenge
yourself and give each shot more meaning and more importantly pay attention to the feedback and make these little
adjustments that are going to be necessary on the golf course so this is like a super in-depth topic obviously I
can’t summarize it in a couple of minutes um but you know what I believe are kind
of the cornerstones of effective practice is that there’s certainly proper engagement on each shot you have
an intention and that could be as basic as your target um maybe it’s just one or two swing
thoughts but there’s enough focus on the shot rather than just kind of what I would call zombie range sessions where
you’re not really thinking about what you’re doing um there’s some type of feedback process after the shot
yeah I talk about this in the book there’s a list of things that I go through every time I hit a shot for me
it happens quickly because I’m used to it where I strike it on the face how is my ground contact what did the ball
flight look like did it start right or left on my target how is the curvature how is the trajectory where did it end
up compared to where I intended to so I’m looking at all this stuff and I’m taking it in I’m saying okay
do I need to make an adjustment here no okay let’s hit another one and if you watch a PGA Tour player practice with
their track man that’s what they’re doing too you see them hit they go back they look at the screen they absorb what
happened they go back into their routine pick their target and hit it’s more regimented it’s it’s more
analytical and there’s a lot more feedback and I don’t think every golfer needs to go that in depth but like let’s
get a little bit more of that versus hit hit hit hit and you’re not
really paying attention to what’s going on or challenging yourself much yeah I guess you can get a long way
there with we certainly you know the the more um the golfers are kind of take into the game more recently in terms of
clarifying some of those Concepts as to what you need to do to produce good golf
shots you know strange meme engine it there hitting the ground in the right place probably the number one place to
start yeah it’s very it’s a concept it’s so simple like we almost feels you know
we’ve I think we’ve done like 75 episodes on our show and ultimately we end up talking about the big three over
and over and over again I’m sure some people get bored of it but it really is that simple what what does this game ask
of you can you strike it somewhere close to the center of their face you do that with your irons and Driver you’re taking
care of like a lot of things the club can do it’s designed to do you’re going to get distance the proper Spin and
launch angle all that stuff uh number two with irons which are the most important scoring clubs can you make
functional contact with the ground hit the ball first and then interact with the Turf and number three which
perhaps my most important thing is managing where that club face is pointing at impact
is it too far open for right-handed golfer your ball is going to start to the right if it’s too far closed it’s
going to start to the left and that combination of your swing path will be how the ball curves that’s it like there’s some other stuff
we could talk about angle of attack and other things but you know we keep coming back to those three things and that’s
you know I don’t have any like complicated swing thoughts going through my head when I’m playing or practicing I
have a laser focus on those three things on every single shot and then I look at the ball and I say
okay that one started too far to the right let’s hit some more and see if that continues okay I have a pattern here I
need to figure out how to close my face a little bit I will solve that through more of like an athletic feel some
golfers might need help with that from an instructor and I I’m totally for golf
instruction getting technical help but it’s got to solve one of those three things not just like hey your swing
looks a little funny at the top let’s make it look prettier is that satisfying the conditions at
impact if it is great if it’s not then you’re just kind of doing it for the sake of doing it I don’t look at video
of my swing I video my swing maybe once a year just for as a joke I don’t I don’t look at it I don’t need to but
that’s the path I’ve chosen I don’t think everyone I I think if you are going to do that then like yeah work with the coach and have a expert set of
eyes look at that but it all gets back to can you answer the questions that
golf is asking of you at the Impact Zone and they are fairly simple if you know
what to look for um yeah our tendency is to complicate things for sure in this game yeah I mean
what you’re talking about there is equally applicable I guess to the more novice golfer he just who’s maybe just
everyone can get into just firing balls at a range just getting into like a machine gun mode but it’s equally
applicable to someone who is maybe overly analytical I someone I know I fall into that that
camp of just wanting to video almost every swing or just look at it from that outside kind of perspective
um your recent podcast with is it Rick Rick
fair just like you know you’re getting so far away from the three basic things
that are actually mattering in this game yeah I think if you’re gonna I’m against so if you’re going at it on your own and
most golfers are I think the number that always comes back is like 80 to 90 of golfers are currently not taking lessons
which I think is a shame I think you know if you want to I don’t know golf’s an expensive activity but
you know if someone said I want to invest 600 in in golf and a new driver or a series of lessons with like a
really good Pro who has it fits your learning style I would say invested with
the pro you’ll get way more out of that but most people don’t do that so if you’re on your own
and you want to be productive with the time that you have you know taking video of your swing and looking at stuff like
I could video my swing and find 20 different things that you know as much as I know about the swing and be like Oh
my face is really shut at the top my takeaway is really on the inside I roll my wrists open at at takeaway as well
sometimes I go past parallel I don’t like my knee bend on the way back like I
could pick out 20 things that I don’t like about my swing aesthetically but to be quite honest like I don’t I
don’t give a crap because I I I let that go a long time ago I’m more concerned with
I’m gonna hit this ball and I’m gonna see what it does and I’m going to use the proper feedback
tool so beginner golfer would say like just understanding like where you’re striking it on the face like Adam’s been
talking about this forever and some other instructors have like that could be transformational for some golfers
like they have no idea where they’re making impact on the face like just practicing with like that laser focus
there and I think there’s an inner athlete in all of us and you’re like oh I’m striking that on the toe I’m striking
that on the heel let me try and make some adjustments I believe if you have a more intent and focus on those things
rather than playing amateur swing doctor you’re going to get a lot farther with your ball striking so it’s you know you
asked me earlier like what can I do to practice productively like those are some simple things that you could your
attention span is not Unlimited in practice and a lot of people spend their time
on swing stuff you know they look at YouTube videos and stuff like that and you know it just might not be relevant
to their swing and and they’re working on the wrong things so it’s just I think you’re kind of taking a shot in the dark with that stuff unless you are working
with an instructor as my big caveat but I think even then you can go awry I think you can work you could instructor
you can there are pro golfers going awry yeah but it’s it’s it’s an easy trap to
fall into um and you know it’s something that Adam I think touches a bit on like in his in
his books um and the podcast that you guys do like just on the strike side of things
moving it around if you’re hitting it like so many people have suffered with dreaded Shanks like just try and hit a few out the toe it sounds pretty basic
but you know if you can move it around the face like that that means you’ve got a pretty good control of of what you do
in the club pretty easily it’s really scary you say that look how many great Pros there are
though when they’re just messing around on the Range they can just like shank It On Demand I think yeah because because
he doesn’t but he can do it if he wants to that’s a perfect example because you
know that skill which we talk about a lot you know what what separates like athletes in any field you know the great
athletes versus like the mediocre to poor ones is like their skills unreal you go like a basketball football hockey
any sport you take you could take a version of what you just said where you you know watch someone in practice doing
something totally wild that they wouldn’t do in a game because they’re in such control of their bodies and they
can adjust their technique at will that they could do anything and that is one of the the big questions that golf asks
of you is that I believe it’s like the ultimate skill game you know you got a side Hill lie how are you going to
adjust your swing the ball’s sitting down a little bit in the rough how are you you know technically what are the things you’re going to have to do well
I’m gonna have to get a little steep with my angle of attack you know to make sure to limit the amount of time the glove the club is interacting with the
grass do you think that Rory McIlroy is thinking about that when the ball is deep in the rough no he’s not he’s just
doing it because his skill is insane now that he acquires that skill from
childhood in all these years hitting balls and he’s doing all these things that we talk about without realizing it
he’s done the technical work and I’m sure he’s done a ton of other work practicing and messing around where he’s
his skills and all the other guys on the tour they’re they’re it’s just off the charts what they can do
but unfortunately I think most golfers believe that it’s the technique
what does my swing look like all that stuff is that is what is driving their success in the game and of course their
technique is sound but I believe there’s something you can’t see you’re not going to see it on the slow motion camera
um that’s inside of them and I think that’s what as I’ve gotten better at this game that’s what I believe I have
um I don’t really understand my technique to be quite honest with you I couldn’t explain I couldn’t explain to
you why I hit golf shots the way I do I guess it comes down to intention
though doesn’t it and I think so many of us fall into that trap of of seeing someone like Rory mcilroy’s got a beautiful free
floating swing and we put the intention as I want to swing the club like that
and he’s not creating that swing with that intention he’s saying I’m trying to hit this ball with a high draw and nice
and shallow or you know maybe even more simply than that and that is the motion
and the way he organizes his body to produce you know his intended outcome he’s not trying to move the club through
all these different positions and you know create emotion like that and yet so many so many people so many instructors
I guess as well will reverse engineering so if we just try and swing it like him then you’ll get good results and it’s
like reverse engineering it but it’s not it’s not effective yeah I think the the
state that so I for a long time played golf in like the
I would say frozen over the ball like what are my five checkpoints I’m gonna hit on my swing before I hit the shot
and that always bothered me because in every other sport I played I reacted in the moment like you’re
playing basketball the opponent’s coming at you I’m not gonna be thinking about what my elbows doing on the jump shot
I’m trying to get the ball out of my hand as soon as possible so it doesn’t get blocked um so it always frustrated me that
I could get better at other sports that were like
faster and in the moment and I didn’t have time to think about that stuff and I got the golf I’m like what the hell am
I thinking about all these things when I’m doing it and as I got better at this game and the style of coaching that I’m
trying to get people in when they play golf is you know when I play now in a tournament Under Pressure whatever
I’m trying to just Target routine hit go and get myself in
that state that I felt in other sports and that’s when I play my best
I find when you see the golfers who are stuck over the ball what are they thinking about that
they’re thinking about their takeaway in the top of their swing and they’re thinking about what their body has to do
to hit the shot and I don’t think that’s going to solve the problem for most people
um so that’s you can’t just achieve that overnight that’s like a mindset shift
it’s in the way you practice it’s your routine it’s how you challenge yourself in practice that’s hard to do but like
that’s that I think is like the Holy Grail of golf is that you play the way in a game or you’re reacting to your
Target and you’re initiating your swing freely as you said the way Rory Springs he’s totally free
um obviously best in the world at it right now but I think people can achieve
that on their own level with the with their own versions of their swing on some level um and get away from like the swing
doctor technical thoughts on the course where they just kind of get up hit and go
um and I think the best version of yourself and you’ll access your skill more often
if you can play that way I think um I think that’s the thing about golf
isn’t it it’s kind of a slow poison I mean it gives you too much time exactly
that’s the problem to think about what it is I think if you said to someone run up to that ball and hit it 150 yards
they kind of get it done in some way shape or form but the fact that you just allow them all the Time in the World to
do it is kind of killer Bruce you’ll know about this wasn’t there something when tiger was in his pump where they like timed him from a dress to impact
and it was like point it was within point one of a second for a whole season
it was I mean it wasn’t no it wasn’t that outrageous but yeah you know like he had very fine tolerances what you’re
driving at is right yeah like he had a very very consistent routine and I know I remember watching a video that Scott
Fawcett made of him at the 2000 US Open and it was all roughly around about 13 seconds I think from yeah being behind
the ball stepping in to actually moment of impact it’s very very consistent
um but not as not not that scary I prefer someone could do that for point
one of a within a 0.1 of a second tolerance for you know 30 events a year across four rounds and you know 70 odd
shots around that would be Bonkers but yeah the the principles right like you know he’s so calm and clear I guess in
in his mental chatter um in terms of what he’s trying to do that that manifests itself the outcome
of that is that he’s just very very consistent time over the ball or time walking into the shot
um it’s it’s something that you can see and and really observe very clearly I think
with with a golfer who’s like in the zone or in full flow as he was obviously for such huge sways of his career but
creating it I think is again it’s it’s a sort of outcome it’s not something I think you can consciously try and create
that’s that’s a byproduct of of being very clear in how you’re approaching the
the shot I think well you make a good point I think one of the struggles is that we do have all
this time in between shots and I like to break it up into like two separate visas almost as at the time in between shots
yeah if I’m playing with my friends or even at a tournament Under Pressure like that’s my time to like kind of enjoy the
activity and kind of soak in the experience um maybe it’s some time to let some
emotion out or refocus my mind but for the most part like if I’m I enjoy walking the course like the time in
between shots I’m kind of like zoning into the experience of of the fun of golf and then when I get to my ball
then I have the process where there’s an analysis of the target the shot routine go and yeah I think
it’s something you can pay attention to in practice and get better at like I believe I you know that the analysis
that Scott did on Tigers pre-shot routine and that people have done it on on a Consortium stem same thing there’s
a study on the European tour where they analyzed how much time players were spending before shots over the ball and
the more consistent players were making more money and having better outcomes and more importantly the ones with shorter pre-shot routines were better as
well which is a very important takeaway so I I do have this in my book and I’m not the first person to Advocate a
pre-shot routine but everyone can have a routine that kind of gets them in that zone I call it like an autopilot State
and initiates that athletic response that I’m looking for where
you’re not even thinking it’s like driving a car and you’re not thinking about where your
hands are on the wheel and pumping you’re just doing it because your body knows how to do it and that’s what I try and hang my hat on in tournament plays
is that my routine over the ball while I’m putting hitting a drive like I’m
initiating this autopilot sequence that is getting me to just hit the damn ball
and not worry about all that other crap that’s going to get in your head in between because the more time you spend
over the ball the less the less confidence you’re going to have I believe so certainly easier said than
done though isn’t it I mean oh yeah this has taken me Years Years
so yeah I played you know the chasing scratch guys I assume they’re they’re uh
awesome guys and I went to their event recently and played some golf with them and
you know they talked to me afterwards they’re like we’re looking at your putting routine it’s like you’re a damn robot like it’s the same thing every
time I’m like yeah I just it’s taken like many years to construct that routine but
I found something that was like truly unique to myself like the what I think about the way I align myself it all has
a purpose it doesn’t take very long but I’ve thought about it in practice I’ve
adjusted it in play and saying like Okay I think I’m taking too many practice strokes this doesn’t need to be too long or or the way I I read the greens and
what I think about I play songs in my head um that’s unique to me and it’s give gives me Comfort and that could be
different for someone else um but it’s something to like start thinking about and paying attention to
you know a lot of golfers just step up to the ball they’ll do things 20 different ways during the round and I’m
not saying if you do the same thing every time it’s going to guarantee you a better result but I think it’s going to
give you a better chance yeah but the most important thing is not to do something for the sake of doing it like
I’ve seen some golfers who have routines where they’re like I’m like okay they’re doing this for the sake of doing it and
I would stack offer for a long time myself um so I think every little part of the
routine whether it takes 15 seconds has to have a purpose you know how you how you choose the
Target and this is what I try and do in my book I’m trying to give people ideas on this so they can coach themselves but
there’s a lot of elements that go into it and it is you can’t just do it overnight it has to be built over a
period of time I believe do you think with the amount of information there is out there in the
game today you know you mentioned that that study of analyzing the routines of European tour Pros or
um you know the amount of stats that there is out there now and tracking stats
um not to mention the whole paraphernalia of of kind of instruction and gizmodes that accompany this swing
itself do you think it it makes it a bit harder for people particularly for the
amateur golfer in a way in that it’s a lot of noise and it’s a lot of
information out there that you know might be driving at some some important
themes in the game but it’s really taking people away from like that mythical art that really is a fundamental part of
golf it is an art of like hitting shots you know being in the right headspace I guess in general terms to hit those
shots and kind of plot your way around a golf course and it’s it’s something that you need to kind of be authentic with
um as an individual you need to like find what works for you and this huge massive information that’s out there can
can maybe encourage people to be become maybe two sort of cookie cutter in their approach to things
yeah I think um absolutely it can I think too much of anything could be a deterrence in in
golf or anything else you pursue so um I am all about like
boiling it down to the most simple things because I think to play your best golf you have to have simple thoughts on
the course so if you’re doing something like let’s say you were deep into stats and then that was putting you in this
head space on the course where you’re like well I have a 27 chance of making this putt so I have to like no don’t
yeah the whole reason I give people statistics or explain like Mark Brody’s work in stroke skin it’s just to let
people understand like okay this is an optimal way to select targets or if you miss a green from 150 yards and you’re
just off the green like understanding that’s still a good shot um so there’s always a
a pro and con to all this stuff where like I yeah I can present a lot of stats to you and I want them to give you like
help with expectation management and Target selection but at the same time I don’t want it to
be cumbersome to your mindset when you’re on the course so this is where people have to learn to be their own
coaches you know you can get all the information and the tools from people but you have to do your
you have to try to do a good job of filtering out stuff um and there I think nothing’s more
problematic than than watching too much swing stuff you know that you know that to me is there’s just so much
information on the swing available and I think they’re all great coaches offering good stuff but you can’t consume it all
it’s not going to make you better just because you watched it um same thing with other yeah you got a
million gadgets launch monitors um stat tracking devices they can be
helpful they can also be detrimental if you get a little too advanced with them so
I prefer Simplicity I’m not against technology I think it can give you really clear indications on what you
need to work on but you have to continually ask yourself is this making the game more complicated for me and if
the answer is yes then I believe you need to tone it down yeah I think I think the stats ones is is a good
example there because it’s as you mentioned John like the expectation management element of it I think is
really beneficial like knowing that absolutely you know the sort of PJ tour dispersion from 150 yards is actually
not as good as you’d think it would be and so you know what right does a scratch handicap or a five or a 10
handicap thing you have to think that they should be hitting the green every time 150 yards or certainly knocking it
closed or anywhere sometimes you know not necessarily through the
author’s fault but just it can kind of like anything can this day and age it can be taken to its Extreme as I know
there’s a big big Trend now for example of just trying to hit driver everywhere like the short Par Four is just almost
from an architecture standpoint people are like well you know no like there’s no stress involved just smash driver at
the green gets close as you can to it that’s the way to do it but actually I think you know it’s more
nuanced than that if you’ve had a terrible day with the driver um up to you know the ninth hole and
then you stand on Ten and it’s a short four and you’re dogmatic with adhering to the stats and thinking that you need
to just get get dog out again and try and take a shot at the green it’s like well that’s not that’s not the emotional intelligence that you need to play the
game well um yeah I think there’s there’s two sides to the coin and I know there’s
always been this like um kind of head butting between you know
Golf Course architecture like what the architect intended and modern strategy
and math and I think it’s kind of like a Choose Your Own Adventure type thing
um you know you could I would say if if I’m you know playing in tournaments and
stuff like that and my absolute goal is to shoot the lowest score then yeah I am going to use the analytics and the data
to my advantage um to so there’s two elements to that you’re
saying that that scenario with the driver on the short Par Four um generally anywhere I would say well yeah
so but it’s not the answer everywhere there’s definitely a rubric for making the decisions
um but you know there’s there’s the Strategic side in the emotional side and I think what good strategy does in golf is is it
removes the emotion like if if you are looking to play your best golf you know
golf is an emotional game and unfortunately like that is one of the reasons why I think you know if you’re
looking to play your best um making decisions based on emotions versus saying like Okay I’m committed to
doing this I’m gonna stick with it and with the understanding that’s not always going to work out
um so yeah it’s hard because I know there’s there’s a million or millions of golfers out there who don’t want to play
the game that way and I think that’s fine too um so I guess the question is is like
what are your goals are your goals to shoot the absolute best score every time
out there and lower your handicap and squeeze every bit of performance you can out of this game
then yeah like I I’m someone like that and I do pay attention to the numbers and I make my plans and I stick with
them um I like doing that if you’re not like that if you’re saying like hey I enjoy playing multiple golf
courses and playing them in a variety of ways like your scenario like I want to hit iron off this team because I just
feel like it’s not the right decision right now like I think that’s fine too is it the right strategic decision
mathematically I I don’t know I can’t play golf with maths that would be my point there like I don’t know yeah
I don’t know if you can because like you know with the the sort of hit driver you
know um stats on on hitting driver on on on hold where there’s like I think the
calculation the rubric you mentioned there is like there’s less than 65 yards oh sorry if there’s more than 65 yards
between penalty areas I water hazards our bounds pick your driver
um I don’t know if I’d question that on the basis of you know taking a sample of
10 or 20 or 30 rounds or 30 shots down a hole like that isn’t how the games necessarily played
like you can wake up one day and feel like you’ve got driver on a rope and play the first few holes and you know
it’s all going well and other days it’s just like okay one One race or another I’m just not comfortable with it and I
can’t you know no matter how hard I try if I try and if I if I take myself out of this and say well no like if I just
hit 10 30 drives on a range or whatever it is they’d all fall within that 65-yard window I should just commit
myself to the hitting driver on this hole this bite the fact that it’s not felt great so so far today I I that to
me seems like maybe it’s not that intelligent from a decision-making standpoint uh well I will question you
this like let’s take another sport um let’s say you know
basketball for example um coach has a plan you know we’re running this offense and certain days
like oh we’re just not feeling it we’re not shooting it as well are they going to tear apart the offense over that probably not they’re gonna they’re gonna
say we’re playing 82 games this year and every night we are going to stick with
this strategy because we believe this is the philosophy that is going to give our team the best performance and I will
Coach you this but some nights it’s not going to feel great um I don’t think they throw it out of
the water and golf is a little different than that because it’s a singular game um but
yeah I mean I it’s not that you’re going out there with like a calculator in your hand
it’s more of an understanding that well in that situation you want to take
the iron because you’re iron that much straighter so I’ve done the testing all day yeah well how do you know on that
day that’s the question I mean
at every Club I know I know you’re gonna to push on this Bruce but every Club is
either the strut the the way the ball goes is a it’s a function of face and path
and the strike but a face and path and if you face a path are off on a particular day no matter what club
you’ve got on your hand your face and path are off now there is an argument I suppose to be said that if you’re facing
Panther off with a seven iron it’s gonna do less damage than say with the face of
path been off with a with a driver in terms of dispersion left and right but
but the the other element in that and again I used to I used to be the golfer that laid back
everywhere because I I played with a lot of fear and what I didn’t realize is that when you do so let’s say you’re
making the decision between a driver and like a forearm for example so let’s say a typical golfer hits their driver 250
yards 240 and they’re hitting their far in 190. so there is the dispersion element for
sure and that absolutely has to come into play because we want to keep it in play off the tee and not get into
penalty areas but there is the distance element and I think what we didn’t
understand for a long time is of how important that was is when you take that forearm like you’re giving up 60 yards
so you might hit that straighter and you will hit it straighter but now the next shot is more challenging so this is I
think the beauty of the game for me and I realize people are coming at this from a different perspective like it sounds
like you you look at this type of analysis as taking away like the art of golf I’m fascinated by it I think it’s
very cool and that’s why I think there’s different ways you could approach the game but the math on it is like pretty it’s
not like very complicated like Mark Brody’s work um you know he ran simulations and
millions of shots and stuff like that and like there is this give and take between driver and shorter clubs and
yeah there are certain days where you’re wiping the driver all over the place and maybe you got to put it in the back you
know maybe you got to make that decision um however I’ve you know not that because I think the
problem with like recreational golf like if I separate that differently like no one you look at recreational golfer
stats like most are hitting it between like 220 and 250 off the tee so we don’t have people with like prodigious lengths
playing this game at the recreational level um so for those golfers to if we’re
talking about distance and Driver if they start taking shorter clubs out
of the bag the game is that much more challenging for them than the pro who’s deciding between 320 and 240 off the tee
because they’re going to hit their irons great but the average golfer they don’t have a lot of swing speed and you put a
four iron in their hands for an approach shot versus an eight iron they’re going to struggle a lot more
from those distances um so yeah like there is there is an inherent math element to this game that
can’t if your goal is to shoot the lowest score and I know I’m sure you know I gotta sound like Boston or Brody
but um I’ve done the research myself I’ve looked at the work um if that’s the point of the game to
shoot your lowest score like yeah I think you can do some analysis you don’t have to go crazy with it
um and I don’t necessarily and that doesn’t mean hit driver ever and try and Bash it um there’s plenty of holes I don’t hit
driver because it doesn’t make sense um but yeah I think that’s I I view that
as one of the beautiful things of the game is looking at the the the risk and reward off the tee you
know I think approach shots you get more conservative for sure but you know and I’ve changed my thinking on this too
like I I hit driver a lot and that’s made me a better golfer because I committed to it I worked on it and I
embraced it and on the days I didn’t feel comfortable with it um I stuck with it because I felt that
was important too um but yeah listen I I get I get the I’ve I’ve heard plenty of the opposing
arguments on social media for years like that’s where I stand on it based on my experience and the work I’ve done
yeah I I don’t you know sort of say that just to just to kind of be contrave and
more just you know like the the stuff that’s not
as easily measurable I guess you know yeah there is there’s stuff that you can’t measure for sure absolutely
there’s a human element to this game that we still can’t put our finger on I agree with you yeah and I guess there’s
you know it’s it’s in it’s a part of human nature that the the the stories of like you know Tiger Woods not pulling a
driver or pulling One driver the week you won the open at Hoy Lake and just this is like a master class in like
course management and and taking trouble out of playing controlling the irons well but distance well with these irons
like or was that just imperious iron play of a different order that you see
very very rarely or you know another example like Jack Nicholas when he I think it was a US Open where he snap
took a couple of snapped hooked a cup snap hooked a couple of drivers early on in the round and was like right I’m just
leaving out in the bag and I’m going down to three with or one iron and you know those kind of
stories that you hear about always that just really intelligent and and course
management and emotional self-awareness rather than defeatism and how you
um balance that with the the mathematic mathematical element that you’re talking about there John I think it’s just part
of the appeal and the entry of the game it’s um it’s difficult I think yeah I even look at it very nostalgically I
think you can look at that tag around and think you know yeah you managed to do it with without a driver or you know you can
look at it very nostalgically but you also can’t look at any any rounds in isolation when when you’re
doing mathematics so to give you um I I I’m the the one in the the cookie jar that likes the statistics and likes
to do all those sorts of things and I think you know I think you’re right Bruce in in some ways that’s you know
you you have to have a feel if you’re not feeling the driver that day you know probably
probably for that day you should put it away but actually if you looked at it over 100 rounds and you continue to take
driver over 100 rounds that over time the better strategy would be to be
closer to the pin because if it’s everyone knows if it’s a 99 or a six iron from no matter where you are
there’s better probability getting the ball in the hole in fewer shots if you’re closest to the hole but I think
you can’t like you say if you’re in the open at High Lake and you’re not feeling driver and you just want to nut a two
iron all day then not a two iron just get it done get you know but I think if you looked it over the over a macro
scale you’re probably not correct would be my take yeah I love the I mean
to be honest I love those stories too and I cited them like when I first started my site
um you know that that I remember watching that open tiger with the irons he had a plan and he said I am not going
to shoot myself in the foot off the tee at this course it’s firm enough I can hit my irons and the reason he was able
to do that is because he was is the best iron player to ever walk the
earth um he could make up for the lack of distance off the T in that tournament
because he was going to hit his approach shots and control the ball immaculately well and Jack Nicholas too like
he had prodigious length he was one of the longest hitters of that time so he was able to use clubs
less than driver off the tee and still compete against his peers because he was
disproportionately long for his era um would that happen today I don’t think
so I don’t think Jack could do that today because his competition would be so immense with distance you know I’ve
spoken to Golfers who’ve competed with Jack Nichols and they told me like you just couldn’t believe how far this guy hit the ball it was incredible he was so
strong and powerful and he could still out drive someone with a two iron you know back then you didn’t have
athletes playing the game as much [Music] um and it was different and now things have
changed and listen I get that people like like I’m a huge basketball fan I was a big basketball fan in my when I
was younger I don’t like watching basketball that much anymore because of what data analytics has done to basketball I just see a bunch of people
running back and forth like hoisting up three pointers and I can’t watch it because that’s not the basketball I
watched when I was a kid I have a hard time watching it so I understand like why people
um don’t like what data has done to golf and the driver thing and all that stuff I get it
um but you know like I’m not here to like argue the math or anything like that like it’s you know they’re they figured
some stuff out and you can apply it on some level to recreational golfers if you want to and if you don’t want to
like that’s fine too I think you don’t have to play the game that way if you don’t want to um I’m not here to like tell anyone to
like enjoy golf a certain way but when it if you’re gonna have like a hardcore discussion with me about like strategy
and stuff like that I’d be like yeah I think I I would rely on the math more than feelings
I think um I think I I mean I hated to to go into
to the distance debate and things about the ball but as long as as long as the ball
doesn’t spin like it used to I think distance you know hitting it far Mark Brody will win you know as long as you
can you can overpower the course but when the ball doesn’t spin like it used to and you can’t get yourself in the
trouble that you used to be able to get yourself into um I kind of feel like you’re never
really gonna to bring that back from people like I mean like it’s hard to argue that Matt Fitzpatrick put on
basically 25 30 yards with a driver over two years and then because that goes out
and wins the US Open I mean it’s if you can hit the ball further and
be closer to the hole golf is easier yeah and I think but the issue is like
the so I’m not like I’m not about the pro game I’m not trying to help like
I’m trying to help Weekend Warriors like enjoy golf more and have some more fun um so what’s happening at the pro level
like I don’t think it’s translated over to the recreational game at all like you can look at the distance numbers like
there’s no distance explosion with average golfers because most people can’t physically generate the swing
speed they’re sitting at deaths all week they’re not working out their hips are too tight they’re not strong enough most
average male golfers are still swinging the club around 90 95 miles an hour where you know tour players have figured
out how to go to 120 125 they’ve got all the training methods um would that be harder with the ball
that spins more maybe I’m not to be quite honest I’m actually not even interested in that debate
um I got involved in it for a while and it doesn’t it doesn’t really interest me that much what’s going on in the Pro game I’m more interested in you know
what can the normal golfer do to optimize their game and and I think you could take a little bit of that stuff
don’t go crazy with it and apply it to your game and you’ll hit a little farther your score a little bit better
and you’ll be happier taking some more money off your buddies um
do you find it um John just with your own game there I mean talking about
um you know helping the weekend golfer and and a lot of the great resources you’ve put out there
um which has made it um I guess brought to light how you how you can play the game a little bit better and how do you find that that
balance wanting to go and compete yourself and shoot the best scores you can travel around to the these
tournaments that you go and play in but also helping others with that do you find there’s a
there’s almost like a split personality you need there to get the best out of your own Golf and uh and helping others
I know on the swing coaching side of things a lot of coaches who say oh it’s just it’s really diffic it can be really difficult to coach the swing and then go
out and try and play myself because I can kind of be populated with these thoughts but I’m guessing from from the way your teacher teaching or coaching
others and the bigger picture ideas you’re talking about maybe that jump isn’t quite so difficult no I to be
quite honest with you um when I teared up with my buddies or in a tournament
um I’m not doing anything all that much differently I don’t have like my serious face time when I play in tournaments I
don’t have my serious face time when I play with my buddies like I’m I’m literally just trying to have fun every time I go out there now I can have fun
playing in a stroke event and putting my game on the line and knowing that I might blow up and play
like crap and that feels bad like I’ve accepted that and it’s happened to me and it doesn’t feel great but I’ve
gotten over it um but I genuinely enjoy competing like that that version of golf is fun for me
but the decisions I make um what clubs I use off the tee the targets
I choose for my Approach shots my pre-shot routine my mental state
it’s not all that different to be quite honest with you um I’m not
I I’m not like in this I used to be like this golfer who like white knuckled it
even when I was playing with my buddies like I would take it so seriously and I want to play so well and if I didn’t
play well I would lose my mind um and that’s not the type of golf I want to play anymore it didn’t make me
happy and it didn’t make me any better so to answer your question like the advice I would give someone playing in a
tournament or around with their buddies like it’s not all that different it’s it’s mostly in the context of improvement and lowering scores for sure
and there’s certain things I would want you to do which is like yeah I want you to be a little bit more regimented with
your with your emotions I want you to make smarter strategic decisions not all
the time but if you were someone who made you know 10 big course management mistakes during the round if we can get
that down to five mistakes that’s great you’re going to see progress or if we can get you to stop
losing your temper a few more times or maybe establish some type of routine
um then that’s I think a huge win and like for sure like my style of coaching
is a little more analytical and it gets certain players interested in it
and for others it might not be for them um so yeah I don’t feel really feel like
I go out you know whether I’m trying to like qualify for the US medam or playing a
match with my friends or something like that like I I really don’t try to do anything that differently
um keep it even kale and and try and get the same yeah yeah those are those are
four or five hours I’ve blocked off in my life that I could have spent with my kids I could have been with my wife I
could have been working on my business um I mean technically like that helps my business because I learned some things
when I play I’m in that in a bit of a strange position there is worked on yeah it is I mean it is I I’ve learned so
much on the course watching other players and seeing what’s going on myself um but I I have to understand like I
blocked off that time also like this is Recreation like this is supposed to be fun yeah and like yeah I like my my
version of recreation could be a little bit more hardcore competitively um and that that’s cool for me for other
people as it might not be you want to go out and drink like three or four beers with your buddy and smack your driver
around and don’t even keep score like I don’t care that’s fun for you go for or like I think that’s great too like
there’s no right way to play this game what does your practice look like um or since you’ve kind of been on this
journey how’s your practice developed and what does it look like now um you know whether that’s just generally in
the kind of regular season or even if you’re gearing up for a for a event that you want to do well in I mean how do you
how do you kind of approach practice and improve more more broadly in terms of playing time hitting balls working on
your short game all that good stuff so I think personally I’ve gotten to a level where
I’ve worked enough and I put in enough hours over the years where I I think I’ve got my skills to like I’m not going
to have any more major breakthroughs in terms of like ball striking like it’s just like little things
um so if anything I split it into like off season and in season so for me in the off season like I can hit balls at
home I have you know a cool little simulator set up so I’m just trying to like preserve my skill so I have a sky
track I’ll go hit balls on the sky check I’ll play simulated rounds I play like online tournaments like games they’re
fun and that gets me hitting different clubs and like thinking about a Target and going through a routine so it kind
of breaks up the monotony I will work on things like ground contact I have a cool
product I’ve mentioned before the divot board there’s now a million knockoffs of it um I’ll work on my ground contact and
I’ll spray the face and make sure my face nothing terribly complicated I work on swing speed in the off season I like
I enjoy working out um just for health benefits so you know I’m lifting weights I’m doing swing
speed work just because like yeah I like seeing how far I can hit my driver and I think it gives me health
benefits so it’s kind of a double win there in season or just off season uh I I
don’t do it as much I still do resistance training during the year now
um that’s something I’m going to try and figure out next year maybe like one speed speed workout a week something
like that um but to be honest in season I don’t have a lot of like dedicated practice
sessions like I do play a lot you know I I try and play like 60 70
rounds a year if something’s wrong on the course I do like a post-round review every time
I play if I’m noticing something’s out of whack then I’m gonna spend like a half hour an
hour working on that thing um it could be I could be uncomfortable with my green side wedges I could be
healing it with my driver and then I’m gonna go to the range I’m going to say this was uncomfortable on the course I
need to make this comfortable again um so in season it’s more I’m playing a lot more I’m paying
attention to feedback on the course and if I see something that is bothering me then I will work on it on the Range but
I’m not a range rat I don’t spend like 20 hours a week hitting golf balls during the year I get bored to be honest
with you yeah so bringing it full circle John we we talked to the top of the podcast about
seeing these these seven things about practice um if you were going to go to a range
and give someone advice on what they should do at the range just
just to make it interesting just to to get the most out of a practice session on the Range so they’ve only got 50
balls 100 Balls whatever they’re doing they’ve only got an hour to scroll away um what would your advice be on
good practice so first and foremost take a moment to
select a Target like think about where you’re hitting it every time is it that pin over there 100 yards
150 yards like half intent on every shot and you can’t get more basic than your
target um if you’re a little bit more you know disciplined you can go through
a routine I like to stand behind the ball look at my target align myself to the ball as I would on the course and
then hit um and then absorb feedback after every shot
and you can go as simple as the big three that we talk about all the time you get yourself some foot spray spray the face with your irons or drivers see
where you’re making contact on the face it’s hard to get ground contact feedback with mats but do your best and then
you’re looking at your ball flight is it curving too much is it starting too far right or left
so a few ways that I like to practice is my Fight Fire with Fire method not I
didn’t invent it plenty of people figured this out you’re slicing the ball you’re hitting it too high you’re hitting it too far right
you’re hitting it off the toe or the heel try and do the opposite
and that will for a lot of people neutralize the core issues so for me for
example I was a big drawer overhooking golf ball for years
I have a more straight ball flight now just trying to consciously fade it on those swings so I’m just doing the
opposite what what did that do that that moved my swing path less into out without actually having to think about
what technically had to do that so I’m a big fan of doing the opposite of the fault you’re seeing
another tried and true method is to introduce some type of variable or
change so don’t hit the seven iron to the same Target over and over again you can do that for a little while but try
and Vary your targets especially with wedges introduce some variability into the
practice and I think that will help with intent so if you had to switch from a 200 yard shot to 100 yard shot it kind
of like resets things um gets you a little more focused on that next shot
um I I love you know Adam is great at coming up with his idea of
you mentioned it earlier consciously start trying to strike different parts of the face
um I like to do experimental stuff sometimes like if I’m if I draw the golf ball I’ll hit some Fades I’ll hit some
low shots just trying to manipulate the golf ball and when you do that it’s not that I want you to go out on the golf
course with like 20 different shots I find that when you start going to extremes and trying different shots it
builds what I would call internal reference points for face control all the things that we were talking about here just striking it well face control
if I know how to hit a big block and a big pull if I know how to hit it really high and hit it really low
um if I know how to strike it on the toe and on the heel well ultimately then I can make those
adjustments on the course when I’m seeing faults show up so some days you know I show up I’m hitting the ball to
the right most of the time now that I’ve kind of gone through all these different challenges while I
practice I have a feel that I can close the club face a little bit with and it’s not a swing thought it’s just
like you know tiger always talks about his feels it’s something that’s like inside of you that’s there and you can
access it and I think one of the ways to do that is to do some experimentation while you practice and try different
things I think that’s one of the cool things about golf too is like what can I do to make this golf ball do different
things like that’s really fun um and another thing some people love to do is you know if you can get a good
list of like practice games or challenges um that’s what’s cool about like some of the modern launch monitors they have
some games built in with them um I do that on my sky track all the time or I’m playing like different
challenges you know I’m trying to hit like here’s another one for you you could take a Target and try and hit three or
four different clubs to the same Target so if you had like 130 yard Target um hit your five iron seven iron
pitching wedge whatever clubs are appropriate for you and you’re varying your swing speed
you’re you’re doing some things in your swing you’re not thinking about it but you’re trying to accomplish a task and like that helps build those skills so I
think if you start doing some of those like what I would call out of the box methods I think for most players like that
self-discovery process will yield better ball striking on the golf course than if
you showed up with your camera and you’re like let’s take a look at my swing today and see what it looks like and play amateur swing doctor I think
you’re going to get more benefit out of that style of practice and that level of Engagement versus like just thinking
about the mechanics of the swing now my caveat to this and this will be my last point I know we’re wrapping up here is
if you are working with an instructor then absolutely do what they’re telling you to do the prescribed drills if there
is camera work if you have like quote unquote adult supervision um then yeah that can make that’s one of
the reasons I tell people to get lessons because they can give you ideas on what to practice based on what your swing you
know faults are so I’m all for getting lessons I think it’s a more efficient way to get better at this game and it
will make your practice more productive but if you’re not going to go that route then like yeah Adam’s book The Practice
manual my book four foundations like we’ve got some ideas in there there’s plenty of other coaches that have great
practice ideas but you know get out get outside of the box a bit is what I’d say because most golfers are just showing up
and just rifling through the bucket with the same club and the same Target and I don’t really see the benefit to that
unless you have this like incredible focus and determination which a lot of people don’t not to um not to want to
draw you into two controversial point to end on John but um done that on on what
you said there’s quite interesting you know having a swing coach and working on something diligently with them is a good
idea do you think you maybe get to a point now where if the swing is functional enough
good enough you can actually dispense with that and I’m guessing just inferring from from the way you’ve been
speaking about it in your own Journey there I presume you don’t really work with a swing coach much anymore you feel
like it’s you’re competent enough with that and you just kind of keep it maintained through these skill based variable tasks you’re absolutely right I
think I got a lot of lessons growing up and they really helped me you know I was fortunate enough my parents were able to
get me some coaching I was staying full to them for that and that got me on the right path I haven’t taken a swing
lesson in 12 years so yeah I’m at that point where I I don’t anticipate I’m
going to need help with my swing anymore if I do luckily I I have a few people’s
phone numbers who I would trust to have them look at something if I couldn’t figure it out myself but I think for the
golfers who are really struggling so I get messages all the time from golfers they’re like I don’t know where the ball
is going like I’m totally lost I’m like go you know get a few lessons just like have someone look at this
thing like let’s get you like some type of Direction and if you get a good Pro
like they can make that process more efficient so for the beginner to intermediate player like absolutely I
think like lessons should be part of your plan at some point but yeah like if you reach a certain level of proficiency
then you could do really well with this style of practice and then maybe get a
check in like a couple times a year just to make sure you’re on the right path like sometimes like that interaction with the coach can be really helpful for
a number of reasons and not just your swing um they could just be like a conversation about you know your mental
game or practice habits it doesn’t always have to be about technique um so yeah I think you could you could
do both does everyone need a swing coach all the time like no way I don’t I don’t think that
it’s funny how people reach out to you on uh on all sorts of mediums we’re on Twitter and feel like it can be solved
in 140 characters but John you have been an absolute gen thank you for joining
the podcast if someone wanted to get hold of the four foundations book where is the best place to to go
amazon.com
all good bookstores and some rubbish ones as well is it just Amazon unfortunately as a self-published author
these days um I looked very deep into the publishing industry like there aren’t you know I want to get my book in stores
and stuff like that like the game has changed unfortunately so No One’s Gonna find my book at their local bookstore
I’m sorry uh Amazon is is the main distributor and they’ve they’ve helped
me get it out there so it is what it is but yeah you’ve got an audiobook as well is that right I do yeah I made an
audiobook because people kept asking me like I don’t read books I listen to them so I I went through this horrible process of listening to myself read my
book over the summer which was Dreadful everyone everyone hates their own voice
and I really hate my own voice so that was fun so yeah you can get the Kindle paperback hardcover or audiobook on
Amazon Apple Books I think I’ve got on Kobo and Barnes Noble so there’s a few places online but Amazon’s obviously the
easiest John thank you very much indeed for joining the podcast thanks thanks guys